000 discontinued?

Discussion of Panerai watches.
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Americandave
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000 discontinued?

Post by Americandave » Thu Jun 09, 2016 4:42 am

I saw a rumor on Rolex forum that this model was discontinued. Any truth to it? If so I'm off to my Ad for his

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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by jimyritz » Thu Jun 09, 2016 5:54 am

Still on Panerai's web site...

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andrema
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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by andrema » Thu Jun 09, 2016 6:26 am

I would be surprised if they ever discontinued the 000 or 111. Those two base models are the entry drugs of Panerai.
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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by logan2z » Thu Jun 09, 2016 6:58 am

I'd be surprised too but I've sent an email to my AD to confirm.

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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by Panerai7 » Thu Jun 09, 2016 7:11 am

I've seen an R-series 000 so probably not

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Americandave
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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by Americandave » Thu Jun 09, 2016 7:17 am


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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by Panerai7 » Thu Jun 09, 2016 7:28 am

What a crock of shit, they call non-removable bezel, springs instead of screws and 100M instead of 300M upgrades??? Lol

Besides the upgrades like integrated bezel and easy strap change spring bars which we are familiar with the recent releases of the Luminor Marina 44m family, the new models will also bear the snap on caseback ( and WR100M rating accordingly ). We are also informed that the new ref. Models –unlike their predecessors- will have no extra straps in the box set.

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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by logan2z » Thu Jun 09, 2016 7:59 am

May be time to finally pull the trigger :think:

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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by hoppyjr » Thu Jun 09, 2016 10:36 am

Many Panerai look nice enough, but that company is a rapist.

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Americandave
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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by Americandave » Thu Jun 09, 2016 4:10 pm

hoppyjr wrote:Many Panerai look nice enough, but that company is a rapist.

Outrageous. I wouldn't be surprised if they came up with a limited edition "pacific ops" series made in China and tried to sell it for 3k

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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by blkgsl » Thu Jun 09, 2016 8:20 pm

Americandave wrote:
hoppyjr wrote:Many Panerai look nice enough, but that company is a rapist.

Outrageous. I wouldn't be surprised if they came up with a limited edition "pacific ops" series made in China and tried to sell it for 3k
They did. The 318. Except they charged 6k


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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by Chocodove » Thu Jun 09, 2016 8:38 pm

hoppyjr wrote:Many Panerai look nice enough, but that company is a rapist.
The same can be said for many watch companies.
- Todd

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Americandave
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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by Americandave » Thu Jun 09, 2016 11:31 pm

blkgsl wrote:
Americandave wrote:
hoppyjr wrote:Many Panerai look nice enough, but that company is a rapist.

Outrageous. I wouldn't be surprised if they came up with a limited edition "pacific ops" series made in China and tried to sell it for 3k
They did. The 318. Except they charged 6k


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Haha, I remember that - they must have seen the humour in selling the Brooklyn bridge model!

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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by blkgsl » Fri Jun 10, 2016 12:04 am

Americandave wrote:
blkgsl wrote:
Americandave wrote:
hoppyjr wrote:Many Panerai look nice enough, but that company is a rapist.

Outrageous. I wouldn't be surprised if they came up with a limited edition "pacific ops" series made in China and tried to sell it for 3k
They did. The 318. Except they charged 6k


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Haha, I remember that - they must have seen the humour in selling the Brooklyn bridge model!
Imo that was the beginning of the end for Panerai. It turned away a lot of serious ristis. Then came a cluster of additional missteps. One day, I truly believe panerai will make a good case study for branding and marketing scholars.


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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by hoppyjr » Fri Jun 10, 2016 1:07 am

blkgsl wrote:
Americandave wrote:
blkgsl wrote:
Americandave wrote:
hoppyjr wrote:Many Panerai look nice enough, but that company is a rapist.

Outrageous. I wouldn't be surprised if they came up with a limited edition "pacific ops" series made in China and tried to sell it for 3k
They did. The 318. Except they charged 6k


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Haha, I remember that - they must have seen the humour in selling the Brooklyn bridge model!
Imo that was the beginning of the end for Panerai. It turned away a lot of serious ristis. Then came a cluster of additional missteps. One day, I truly believe panerai will make a good case study for branding and marketing scholars.


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I agree. I've owned a half-dozen or so, but won't buy again. I do like the style, but the company sucks. I had a terrible service experience that dragged on for multiple visits over several months. The Brooklyn Bridge edition was telling, as are these new reduced feature snap-back models. It appears Panerai is trying to become an expensive alternative for the mall-watch crowd.

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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by Americandave » Fri Jun 10, 2016 2:14 am

It's a shame because they do have a really unique, cool style. To go from not being able to get them to not being able to flip them is a major failure on the company's part.

Seems like they just couldn't stay on top of features that would justify the prices that their early hits reached.

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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by logan2z » Fri Jun 10, 2016 4:08 am

Americandave wrote:It's a shame because they do have a really unique, cool style. To go from not being able to get them to not being able to flip them is a major failure on the company's part.

Seems like they just couldn't stay on top of features that would justify the prices that their early hits reached.
IMO that's a sweeping generalization. If you mean you can't flip them for a profit or for close to MSRP then that's true, but how many watches will return your investment on resale?

I see plenty of Panerais marked 'sold' on watchrecon. I sold my 111 last year for a price that wasn't very much less than I paid several years before. Unfortunately I see lots of delusional sellers asking close to current MSRP for used Panerais and of course the watches sit unsold.

I think your comment about the change in availability of Panerais applies to other brands as well. It was only a handful of years ago that you could not find an IWC Big Pilot in stock at an AD. They were sold before they ever hit the display case. Now every AD I've visited in the past couple of years has one languishing in the case. The watch market simply isn't what it was.

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Americandave
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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by Americandave » Fri Jun 10, 2016 4:20 am

No doubt the watch market is generally soft, but Panerai used to be unusually hot. It wasn't just that they sold before they got on the shelf - boutiques were essentially handing profit to their favourites because they could actually be resold for over MSRP in some cases. This even as MSRP was sky rocketing. It was a complete craze.

What'd they do with it? They bet that goodwill against so many new models (some with inferior components) that you can google any random three numbers and get a PAM. Not a great move for their collectors and brand die hards.

I still want a base logo.

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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by logan2z » Fri Jun 10, 2016 4:24 am

hoppyjr wrote:
blkgsl wrote:
Americandave wrote:
blkgsl wrote:
Americandave wrote:
hoppyjr wrote:Many Panerai look nice enough, but that company is a rapist.

Outrageous. I wouldn't be surprised if they came up with a limited edition "pacific ops" series made in China and tried to sell it for 3k
They did. The 318. Except they charged 6k


Sent from Tapatalk
Haha, I remember that - they must have seen the humour in selling the Brooklyn bridge model!
Imo that was the beginning of the end for Panerai. It turned away a lot of serious ristis. Then came a cluster of additional missteps. One day, I truly believe panerai will make a good case study for branding and marketing scholars.


Sent from Tapatalk
I agree. I've owned a half-dozen or so, but won't buy again. I do like the style, but the company sucks. I had a terrible service experience that dragged on for multiple visits over several months. The Brooklyn Bridge edition was telling, as are these new reduced feature snap-back models. It appears Panerai is trying to become an expensive alternative for the mall-watch crowd.
Name a luxury watch brand and I'll quickly find a forum post (or five) describing a negative service experience. I've heard them about every brand including Sinn, Omega, JLC, Patek, and even Rolex, and experienced some myself. This seems to be a problem that plagues the watch industry in general.

I don't want to come off as an apologist for the brand. I do think they make some nice watches and credit them for making the transition to full manufacturer (I hear few complaints about their manufactured movements) but I think they got a bit cocky and that has led to some blunders. I still wouldn't hesitate to pick up a classic like the 000 before they disappear. These watches (along with the 005, 112, etc) represent the essence of the brand and I think they will continue to be fairly desirable.

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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by logan2z » Fri Jun 10, 2016 4:49 am

Americandave wrote:No doubt the watch market is generally soft, but Panerai used to be unusually hot. It wasn't just that they sold before they got on the shelf - boutiques were essentially handing profit to their favourites because they could actually be resold for over MSRP in some cases. This even as MSRP was sky rocketing. It was a complete craze.

What'd they do with it? They bet that goodwill against so many new models (some with inferior components) that you can google any random three numbers and get a PAM. Not a great move for their collectors and brand die hards.

I still want a base logo.
True. I think to some degree they are victims of their own success.

Richemont no doubt saw the enormous demand for the watches and figured that there was a lot of money being left on the table by continuing to dribble out a handful of models in limited numbers. While that led to frenzied demand it also likely failed to result in the revenue that Richemont figured was possible. So more models in higher numbers, and a little cost-cutting thrown in for good measure, was the result. This unfortunately led to the dilution of the brand and loss of interest from collectors who no longer felt 'special' .

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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by Americandave » Fri Jun 10, 2016 4:54 am

logan2z wrote:
Americandave wrote:No doubt the watch market is generally soft, but Panerai used to be unusually hot. It wasn't just that they sold before they got on the shelf - boutiques were essentially handing profit to their favourites because they could actually be resold for over MSRP in some cases. This even as MSRP was sky rocketing. It was a complete craze.

What'd they do with it? They bet that goodwill against so many new models (some with inferior components) that you can google any random three numbers and get a PAM. Not a great move for their collectors and brand die hards.

I still want a base logo.
True. I think to some degree they are victims of their own success.

Richemont no doubt saw the enormous demand for the watches and figured that there was a lot of money being left on the table by continuing to dribble out a handful of models in limited numbers. While that led to frenzied demand it also likely failed to result in the revenue that Richemont figured was possible. So more models in higher numbers, and a little cost-cutting thrown in for good measure, was the result. This unfortunately led to the dilution of the brand and loss of interest from collectors who no longer felt 'special' .

Yep, but I have to agree that despite it all those bread and butter models will continue to be hits. I currently have a 328 and have considered trading for a 372, and adding a 000. I don't necessarily love the brand and the hype but I love the unique style. These are the only watches I've ever collected without a moving bezel!

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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by logan2z » Fri Jun 10, 2016 5:06 am

Americandave wrote:
logan2z wrote:
Americandave wrote:No doubt the watch market is generally soft, but Panerai used to be unusually hot. It wasn't just that they sold before they got on the shelf - boutiques were essentially handing profit to their favourites because they could actually be resold for over MSRP in some cases. This even as MSRP was sky rocketing. It was a complete craze.

What'd they do with it? They bet that goodwill against so many new models (some with inferior components) that you can google any random three numbers and get a PAM. Not a great move for their collectors and brand die hards.

I still want a base logo.
True. I think to some degree they are victims of their own success.

Richemont no doubt saw the enormous demand for the watches and figured that there was a lot of money being left on the table by continuing to dribble out a handful of models in limited numbers. While that led to frenzied demand it also likely failed to result in the revenue that Richemont figured was possible. So more models in higher numbers, and a little cost-cutting thrown in for good measure, was the result. This unfortunately led to the dilution of the brand and loss of interest from collectors who no longer felt 'special' .

Yep, but I have to agree that despite it all those bread and butter models will continue to be hits. I currently have a 328 and have considered trading for a 372, and adding a 000. I don't necessarily love the brand and the hype but I love the unique style. These are the only watches I've ever collected without a moving bezel!
The hype never interested me either. I just like the style of the watches and enjoy brands with (legitimately) storied backgrounds.

In the 8 or so years I've been into watches I've only owned three Panerais. I still have two (a 190 and 372) and will likely add a 000 soon.

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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by JP Chestnut » Fri Jun 10, 2016 6:06 am

logan2z wrote:
Americandave wrote:It's a shame because they do have a really unique, cool style. To go from not being able to get them to not being able to flip them is a major failure on the company's part.

Seems like they just couldn't stay on top of features that would justify the prices that their early hits reached.
IMO that's a sweeping generalization. If you mean you can't flip them for a profit or for close to MSRP then that's true, but how many watches will return your investment on resale?

I see plenty of Panerais marked 'sold' on watchrecon. I sold my 111 last year for a price that wasn't very much less than I paid several years before. Unfortunately I see lots of delusional sellers asking close to current MSRP for used Panerais and of course the watches sit unsold.

I think your comment about the change in availability of Panerais applies to other brands as well. It was only a handful of years ago that you could not find an IWC Big Pilot in stock at an AD. They were sold before they ever hit the display case. Now every AD I've visited in the past couple of years has one languishing in the case. The watch market simply isn't what it was.
extrapolating the health of the watch market based on the health of two richemont brands that were badly managed, doesn't make a lot of sense.

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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by jimyritz » Fri Jun 10, 2016 7:15 am

Overall like the brand--Panerai has so many models though; outside of Radiomir vs Luminor it's hard to differentiate...Love the base models along with the 372, 422, 312, 183, etc...Might own a 1392 or 1523 at some point...

That being said, watch pricing in general is ridiculous--Every brand has good service stories and bad.. :shrug:

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Re: 000 discontinued?

Post by logan2z » Fri Jun 10, 2016 7:23 am

JP Chestnut wrote:
logan2z wrote:
Americandave wrote:It's a shame because they do have a really unique, cool style. To go from not being able to get them to not being able to flip them is a major failure on the company's part.

Seems like they just couldn't stay on top of features that would justify the prices that their early hits reached.
IMO that's a sweeping generalization. If you mean you can't flip them for a profit or for close to MSRP then that's true, but how many watches will return your investment on resale?

I see plenty of Panerais marked 'sold' on watchrecon. I sold my 111 last year for a price that wasn't very much less than I paid several years before. Unfortunately I see lots of delusional sellers asking close to current MSRP for used Panerais and of course the watches sit unsold.

I think your comment about the change in availability of Panerais applies to other brands as well. It was only a handful of years ago that you could not find an IWC Big Pilot in stock at an AD. They were sold before they ever hit the display case. Now every AD I've visited in the past couple of years has one languishing in the case. The watch market simply isn't what it was.
extrapolating the health of the watch market based on the health of two richemont brands that were badly managed, doesn't make a lot of sense.
Agreed, just two examples of a well-documented decline.

http://www.barrons.com/articles/swiss-w ... 1459486907

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