Discussion of Panerai watches.
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Expat
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by Expat » Thu Sep 19, 2013 8:15 am
matt.wu wrote:I don't think Mike's original argument was that Panerai sucks compared to Rolex. But comparing this faux-vintage Panerai (10-20 year old watches with EASILY currently sourced mass-produced movement = vintage and $20k???) to actual vintage Rolex (many watches which have a documented history and place within horology or cultural history - i.e. Newman Daytona) and saying they're somehow on par is making an argument for argument's sake. No one in their right logical mind can say that they're the same, even if you don't
get Rolex or don't
get vintage.
I got no dog in the fight. These days, I am more heavy on Panerai than Rolex, but you can't deny the difference in the way the companies (or fanboys of the companies) are using the word vintage. Now, if we were talking Panerai 6154 or any other ACTUAL vintage, that'd be different. But we're talking stupid "Pre-V" or "Pre-A" which are virtually identical to the watches that they mass produce today yet somehow command a premium because some Paneristi nerd proclaimed them extra special.
Leave the poor guy alone.
I think is a yes, but..."some P nerd claimed them extra special" is a straw man. There extra special because of why they were made, the low numbers they were made in and what happened thereafter with the brand.
What will Pam be in 20 years. They've moved to in house. They've moved to Switzerland, which could be viewed as a negative, but not by many. Will they continue to innovate, be popular and become a luxery fixture? If they do, then a well documented Pre A or V is a piece of a pretty cool story.
I'm sure when Newman's were $20k people going are you kidding me......
"30ish years of martial arts and I've actually had the honor of training lots of LEO, spec ops and even SEAL team 6 on base, fitness training, not martial arts, but still the coolest thing I've done.
Full on egg head corporate job and I fly quite a bit so I'm really looking forward to adding to my collection of TSA friendly self defense tools. I have amcouple tactical pens, but I want to up the game and get into some custom stuff. Been watch obsessed for a while but this seems more fun.
Thanks for letting me play! "
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logan2z
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by logan2z » Thu Sep 19, 2013 8:17 am
JP Chestnut wrote:demer03 wrote:CGSshorty wrote:demer03 wrote:CGSshorty wrote:demer03 wrote:Panerai7 wrote:demer03 wrote:Panerai is not Rolex.....
Rolex is nothing special either.
It's a mass-priduced high quality product with minimal involvement of a human watchmaker.
At least Panerai is somewhat limited in production numbers. I think they make more Rolex Subs than Honda Accords.
Sorry. I like P...I really do.
But...I do believe Rolex is way above them on many levels. Panerai make some cool stuff, but it is comparing apples and oranges in my humble opinion.
Yes, those shitty bracelets and fucked up dials are amazing testaments to Rolex quality.
Your fantasy....make it how you want
Really Mike? Are you going to make the argument that the bracelet from any Rolex made before the last few years was a high quality bracelet? Guys use fantasy to justify that a watch with a cracked dial and saggy bracelet are worth a fortune all the time. Is it only Rolex that gets to use fantasy to justify high secondary prices?
I am certainly not saying that the Panerai in question should ever have sold for what it did, but lots of shitty watches sell for questionable prices all the time.
...but I guess I still see P as a reincarnation of a former company that relied on a perceived history to come back.
This is an interesting comment because it perfectly matches my (admittedly ignorant) opinion of the brand. Can someone knowledgeable confirm or refute that current Panerai is a purchased name reincarnation of the original company?
The original company (still operating) was purchased by Richemont in 1997. So I'm not sure I'd call it a reincarnation in the same way as, say, a company like DOXA whose name was purchased and a new company formed with no relation to the old.
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by JP Chestnut » Thu Sep 19, 2013 8:19 am
logan2z wrote:JP Chestnut wrote:demer03 wrote:CGSshorty wrote:demer03 wrote:CGSshorty wrote:demer03 wrote:Panerai7 wrote:demer03 wrote:Panerai is not Rolex.....
Rolex is nothing special either.
It's a mass-priduced high quality product with minimal involvement of a human watchmaker.
At least Panerai is somewhat limited in production numbers. I think they make more Rolex Subs than Honda Accords.
Sorry. I like P...I really do.
But...I do believe Rolex is way above them on many levels. Panerai make some cool stuff, but it is comparing apples and oranges in my humble opinion.
Yes, those shitty bracelets and fucked up dials are amazing testaments to Rolex quality.
Your fantasy....make it how you want
Really Mike? Are you going to make the argument that the bracelet from any Rolex made before the last few years was a high quality bracelet? Guys use fantasy to justify that a watch with a cracked dial and saggy bracelet are worth a fortune all the time. Is it only Rolex that gets to use fantasy to justify high secondary prices?
I am certainly not saying that the Panerai in question should ever have sold for what it did, but lots of shitty watches sell for questionable prices all the time.
...but I guess I still see P as a reincarnation of a former company that relied on a perceived history to come back.
This is an interesting comment because it perfectly matches my (admittedly ignorant) opinion of the brand. Can someone knowledgeable confirm or refute that current Panerai is a purchased name reincarnation of the original company?
The original company (still operating) was purchased by Richemont in 1997. So I'm not sure I'd call it a reincarnation in the same way as, say, a company like DOXA whose name was purchased and a new company formed with no relation to the old.
Thanks for the clarification - if that's correct, they would be no different than IWC or JLC (continuously operated under various owners, eventually ending up with Richemont).
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matt.wu
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by matt.wu » Thu Sep 19, 2013 8:25 am
Expat wrote:matt.wu wrote:I don't think Mike's original argument was that Panerai sucks compared to Rolex. But comparing this faux-vintage Panerai (10-20 year old watches with EASILY currently sourced mass-produced movement = vintage and $20k???) to actual vintage Rolex (many watches which have a documented history and place within horology or cultural history - i.e. Newman Daytona) and saying they're somehow on par is making an argument for argument's sake. No one in their right logical mind can say that they're the same, even if you don't
get Rolex or don't
get vintage.
I got no dog in the fight. These days, I am more heavy on Panerai than Rolex, but you can't deny the difference in the way the companies (or fanboys of the companies) are using the word vintage. Now, if we were talking Panerai 6154 or any other ACTUAL vintage, that'd be different. But we're talking stupid "Pre-V" or "Pre-A" which are virtually identical to the watches that they mass produce today yet somehow command a premium because some Paneristi nerd proclaimed them extra special.
Leave the poor guy alone.
I think is a yes, but..."some P nerd claimed them extra special" is a straw man. There extra special because of why they were made, the low numbers they were made in and what happened thereafter with the brand.
What will Pam be in 20 years. They've moved to in house. They've moved to Switzerland, which could be viewed as a negative, but not by many. Will they continue to innovate, be popular and become a luxery fixture? If they do, then a well documented Pre A or V is a piece of a pretty cool story.
I'm sure when Newman's were $20k people going are you kidding me......
It'll be a pretty cool part of "Panerai 2.0" history, but that's about it. Not horological history.... maybe some cultural history with the Sly story.
And "made in low numbers"? That's exactly why I'm saying they're of contrived value. They
aren't made in low numbers. Aside from the numbering and the type of lume used, they're the exact same watch as is still being produced today.
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matt.wu
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by matt.wu » Thu Sep 19, 2013 8:26 am
JP Chestnut wrote:logan2z wrote:JP Chestnut wrote:demer03 wrote:CGSshorty wrote:demer03 wrote:CGSshorty wrote:demer03 wrote:Panerai7 wrote:demer03 wrote:Panerai is not Rolex.....
Rolex is nothing special either.
It's a mass-priduced high quality product with minimal involvement of a human watchmaker.
At least Panerai is somewhat limited in production numbers. I think they make more Rolex Subs than Honda Accords.
Sorry. I like P...I really do.
But...I do believe Rolex is way above them on many levels. Panerai make some cool stuff, but it is comparing apples and oranges in my humble opinion.
Yes, those shitty bracelets and fucked up dials are amazing testaments to Rolex quality.
Your fantasy....make it how you want
Really Mike? Are you going to make the argument that the bracelet from any Rolex made before the last few years was a high quality bracelet? Guys use fantasy to justify that a watch with a cracked dial and saggy bracelet are worth a fortune all the time. Is it only Rolex that gets to use fantasy to justify high secondary prices?
I am certainly not saying that the Panerai in question should ever have sold for what it did, but lots of shitty watches sell for questionable prices all the time.
...but I guess I still see P as a reincarnation of a former company that relied on a perceived history to come back.
This is an interesting comment because it perfectly matches my (admittedly ignorant) opinion of the brand. Can someone knowledgeable confirm or refute that current Panerai is a purchased name reincarnation of the original company?
The original company (still operating) was purchased by Richemont in 1997. So I'm not sure I'd call it a reincarnation in the same way as, say, a company like DOXA whose name was purchased and a new company formed with no relation to the old.
Thanks for the clarification - if that's correct, they would be no different than IWC or JLC (continuously operated under various owners, eventually ending up with Richemont).
The extent to which Panerai was still effectively a watch company though is not the nearly the same as IWC or JLC though, from what I recall.
I could be misremembering, but that's my general understanding.
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logan2z
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by logan2z » Thu Sep 19, 2013 8:34 am
matt.wu wrote:JP Chestnut wrote:logan2z wrote:JP Chestnut wrote:demer03 wrote:CGSshorty wrote:demer03 wrote:CGSshorty wrote:demer03 wrote:Panerai7 wrote:[quote="demer03"]Panerai is not Rolex.....
Rolex is nothing special either.
It's a mass-priduced high quality product with minimal involvement of a human watchmaker.
At least Panerai is somewhat limited in production numbers. I think they make more Rolex Subs than Honda Accords.
Sorry. I like P...I really do.
But...I do believe Rolex is way above them on many levels. Panerai make some cool stuff, but it is comparing apples and oranges in my humble opinion.
Yes, those shitty bracelets and fucked up dials are amazing testaments to Rolex quality.
Your fantasy....make it how you want
Really Mike? Are you going to make the argument that the bracelet from any Rolex made before the last few years was a high quality bracelet? Guys use fantasy to justify that a watch with a cracked dial and saggy bracelet are worth a fortune all the time. Is it only Rolex that gets to use fantasy to justify high secondary prices?
I am certainly not saying that the Panerai in question should ever have sold for what it did, but lots of shitty watches sell for questionable prices all the time.
...but I guess I still see P as a reincarnation of a former company that relied on a perceived history to come back.
This is an interesting comment because it perfectly matches my (admittedly ignorant) opinion of the brand. Can someone knowledgeable confirm or refute that current Panerai is a purchased name reincarnation of the original company?
The original company (still operating) was purchased by Richemont in 1997. So I'm not sure I'd call it a reincarnation in the same way as, say, a company like DOXA whose name was purchased and a new company formed with no relation to the old.
Thanks for the clarification - if that's correct, they would be no different than IWC or JLC (continuously operated under various owners, eventually ending up with Richemont).
The extent to which Panerai was still effectively a watch company though is not the nearly the same as IWC or JLC though, from what I recall.
I could be misremembering, but that's my general understanding.[/quote]
I believe the company was still operating and producing watches, albeit in a much more modest way than IWC and JLC. But I think (and someone correct me if I'm wrong) that there has been continuity in terms of the company's existence.
Some additional info here:
http://www.paneristi.com/archives/history.html
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demer03
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by demer03 » Thu Sep 19, 2013 8:56 am
zepp21 wrote:demer03 wrote:Yep. Too bad he peaked and crashed.
Kobolds wouldn't be the only one. Doxa also comes to mind.
Spot on
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demer03
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by demer03 » Thu Sep 19, 2013 8:58 am
logan2z wrote:
I believe the company was still operating and producing watches, albeit in a much more modest way than IWC and JLC. But I think (and someone correct me if I'm wrong) that there has been continuity in terms of the company's existence.
Some additional info here:
http://www.paneristi.com/archives/history.html
Good to know. I misunderstood it as a purchase of a dead company. Thanks!
Old Michigan steams like a young man's dreams
The islands and bays are for sportsmen
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by JP Chestnut » Thu Sep 19, 2013 9:02 am
demer03 wrote:logan2z wrote:
I believe the company was still operating and producing watches, albeit in a much more modest way than IWC and JLC. But I think (and someone correct me if I'm wrong) that there has been continuity in terms of the company's existence.
Some additional info here:
http://www.paneristi.com/archives/history.html
Good to know. I misunderstood it as a purchase of a dead company. Thanks!
While not exactly encyclopedic, this seems to suggest that might be the case:
Panerai History Link wrote:
Things get a bit hazy here, but as far as I can see the equipment manufacturing end of Officine Panerai drifted out of business after the end of the Second World War.
In 1993 Officine Panerai started to reproduce the Luminor, and the Mare Nostrum chronograph, basically targetted at the collector's market. These were produced only in very limited numbers.
In 1997 Officine Panerai were acquired by the Vendôme group. Under the new bosses basically the same models were produced, still in small numbers. However in a clever marketing move, a few "unique editions" were produced each year, with an intriguing movement or case design.
So what watches where Panerai producing prior to the reintroduction of these models in 1993?
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matt.wu
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by matt.wu » Thu Sep 19, 2013 9:03 am
JP Chestnut wrote:demer03 wrote:logan2z wrote:
I believe the company was still operating and producing watches, albeit in a much more modest way than IWC and JLC. But I think (and someone correct me if I'm wrong) that there has been continuity in terms of the company's existence.
Some additional info here:
http://www.paneristi.com/archives/history.html
Good to know. I misunderstood it as a purchase of a dead company. Thanks!
While not exactly encyclopedic, this seems to suggest that might be the case:
Panerai History Link wrote:
Things get a bit hazy here, but as far as I can see the equipment manufacturing end of Officine Panerai drifted out of business after the end of the Second World War.
In 1993 Officine Panerai started to reproduce the Luminor, and the Mare Nostrum chronograph, basically targetted at the collector's market. These were produced only in very limited numbers.
In 1997 Officine Panerai were acquired by the Vendôme group. Under the new bosses basically the same models were produced, still in small numbers. However in a clever marketing move, a few "unique editions" were produced each year, with an intriguing movement or case design.
So what watches where Panerai producing prior to the reintroduction of these models in 1993?
Basically what I was getting at.
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Panerai7
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by Panerai7 » Thu Sep 19, 2013 9:23 am
Shouldn't we then celebrate Panerai's success?
Their watches are successfully sold all over the world and people pay ridiculous money for them.
What I don't understand why there's such aversion from some? Could it be because some failed to recognize future potential when they were 2200$?
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demer03
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by demer03 » Thu Sep 19, 2013 10:17 am
Panerai7 wrote:What I don't understand why there's such aversion from some? Could it be because some failed to recognize future potential when they were 2200$?
I don't think there has been any aversion espoused here. I'd love a 000 or a 372.
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Expat
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by Expat » Thu Sep 19, 2013 10:24 am
matt.wu wrote:Expat wrote:matt.wu wrote:I don't think Mike's original argument was that Panerai sucks compared to Rolex. But comparing this faux-vintage Panerai (10-20 year old watches with EASILY currently sourced mass-produced movement = vintage and $20k???) to actual vintage Rolex (many watches which have a documented history and place within horology or cultural history - i.e. Newman Daytona) and saying they're somehow on par is making an argument for argument's sake. No one in their right logical mind can say that they're the same, even if you don't
get Rolex or don't
get vintage.
I got no dog in the fight. These days, I am more heavy on Panerai than Rolex, but you can't deny the difference in the way the companies (or fanboys of the companies) are using the word vintage. Now, if we were talking Panerai 6154 or any other ACTUAL vintage, that'd be different. But we're talking stupid "Pre-V" or "Pre-A" which are virtually identical to the watches that they mass produce today yet somehow command a premium because some Paneristi nerd proclaimed them extra special.
Leave the poor guy alone.
I think is a yes, but..."some P nerd claimed them extra special" is a straw man. There extra special because of why they were made, the low numbers they were made in and what happened thereafter with the brand.
What will Pam be in 20 years. They've moved to in house. They've moved to Switzerland, which could be viewed as a negative, but not by many. Will they continue to innovate, be popular and become a luxery fixture? If they do, then a well documented Pre A or V is a piece of a pretty cool story.
I'm sure when Newman's were $20k people going are you kidding me......
It'll be a pretty cool part of "Panerai 2.0" history, but that's about it. Not horological history.... maybe some cultural history with the Sly story.
And "made in low numbers"? That's exactly why I'm saying they're of contrived value. They
aren't made in low numbers. Aside from the numbering and the type of lume used, they're the exact same watch as is still being produced today.
Different cases, different CGs, different dials....so not so much exactly the same. Like saying a SubC is "exactly the same" as a 5513.
"30ish years of martial arts and I've actually had the honor of training lots of LEO, spec ops and even SEAL team 6 on base, fitness training, not martial arts, but still the coolest thing I've done.
Full on egg head corporate job and I fly quite a bit so I'm really looking forward to adding to my collection of TSA friendly self defense tools. I have amcouple tactical pens, but I want to up the game and get into some custom stuff. Been watch obsessed for a while but this seems more fun.
Thanks for letting me play! "
citizenfox
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matt.wu
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by matt.wu » Thu Sep 19, 2013 10:51 am
Expat wrote:matt.wu wrote:Expat wrote:matt.wu wrote:I don't think Mike's original argument was that Panerai sucks compared to Rolex. But comparing this faux-vintage Panerai (10-20 year old watches with EASILY currently sourced mass-produced movement = vintage and $20k???) to actual vintage Rolex (many watches which have a documented history and place within horology or cultural history - i.e. Newman Daytona) and saying they're somehow on par is making an argument for argument's sake. No one in their right logical mind can say that they're the same, even if you don't
get Rolex or don't
get vintage.
I got no dog in the fight. These days, I am more heavy on Panerai than Rolex, but you can't deny the difference in the way the companies (or fanboys of the companies) are using the word vintage. Now, if we were talking Panerai 6154 or any other ACTUAL vintage, that'd be different. But we're talking stupid "Pre-V" or "Pre-A" which are virtually identical to the watches that they mass produce today yet somehow command a premium because some Paneristi nerd proclaimed them extra special.
Leave the poor guy alone.
I think is a yes, but..."some P nerd claimed them extra special" is a straw man. There extra special because of why they were made, the low numbers they were made in and what happened thereafter with the brand.
What will Pam be in 20 years. They've moved to in house. They've moved to Switzerland, which could be viewed as a negative, but not by many. Will they continue to innovate, be popular and become a luxery fixture? If they do, then a well documented Pre A or V is a piece of a pretty cool story.
I'm sure when Newman's were $20k people going are you kidding me......
It'll be a pretty cool part of "Panerai 2.0" history, but that's about it. Not horological history.... maybe some cultural history with the Sly story.
And "made in low numbers"? That's exactly why I'm saying they're of contrived value. They
aren't made in low numbers. Aside from the numbering and the type of lume used, they're the exact same watch as is still being produced today.
Different cases, different CGs, different dials....so not so much exactly the same. Like saying a SubC is "exactly the same" as a 5513.
Sounding a little more desperate now.
So Panerai is the flavor for the week, eh?
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by JBZ » Thu Sep 19, 2013 10:53 am
Panerai7 wrote:Shouldn't we then celebrate Panerai's success?
Their watches are successfully sold all over the world and people pay ridiculous money for them.
What I don't understand why there's such aversion from some? Could it be because some failed to recognize future potential when they were 2200$?
I think it relates more to the perception some people have of Pam owners (which is basically the same as the perception some have of Rollie owners); that they are vapid toolbags. Unfair, but there it is I'm afraid.
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by JP Chestnut » Thu Sep 19, 2013 11:14 am
JBZ wrote:Panerai7 wrote:Shouldn't we then celebrate Panerai's success?
Their watches are successfully sold all over the world and people pay ridiculous money for them.
What I don't understand why there's such aversion from some? Could it be because some failed to recognize future potential when they were 2200$?
I think it relates more to the perception some people have of Pam owners (which is basically the same as the perception some have of Rollie owners); that they are vapid toolbags. Unfair, but there it is I'm afraid.
I always thought the joke with Panerai was "the Rolex for guys who don't want to own a Rolex". I don't have a problem with the brand, they're distinctive looking and not more overpriced than anything else. I'll never own a Panerai (too large and too odd looking for me) but I can see why some like them. The brand really adds character to the landscape of modern watches and we need more of that.
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toxicavenger
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by toxicavenger » Thu Sep 19, 2013 11:31 am
first thing that "P" site layout sucks balls.
second, that dude tried to make a profit and lost out, so he is crying wolf now
third, that looks like the same Bridge movement sham that came out a while back. same og, over priced, shelf movement and people still buy it
forth, who gives a fuck
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by jeckyll » Thu Sep 19, 2013 12:21 pm
toxicavenger wrote:first thing that "P" site layout sucks balls.
second, that dude tried to make a profit and lost out, so he is crying wolf now
third, that looks like the same Bridge movement sham that came out a while back. same og, over priced, shelf movement and people still buy it
forth, who gives a fuck
Good lord, I agree with everything you said... It feels wrong
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Panerai7
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by Panerai7 » Thu Sep 19, 2013 12:32 pm
JBZ wrote:Panerai7 wrote:Shouldn't we then celebrate Panerai's success?
Their watches are successfully sold all over the world and people pay ridiculous money for them.
What I don't understand why there's such aversion from some? Could it be because some failed to recognize future potential when they were 2200$?
I think it relates more to the perception some people have of Pam owners (which is basically the same as the perception some have of Rollie owners); that they are vapid toolbags. Unfair, but there it is I'm afraid.
Well I guess you all live in cooler places and see these dbags with Pam's all the time.
I have only seen 1 Pam in the past year and that was Brice during our GTG.
On the other hand I see Rolex wearers all the time, some show the wrong time I guess they think a battery died and are too lazy to change the battery
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by CGSshorty » Thu Sep 19, 2013 12:32 pm
jeckyll wrote:toxicavenger wrote:first thing that "P" site layout sucks balls.
second, that dude tried to make a profit and lost out, so he is crying wolf now
third, that looks like the same Bridge movement sham that came out a while back. same og, over priced, shelf movement and people still buy it
forth, who gives a fuck
Good lord, I agree with everything you said... It feels wrong
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2
P.com is the worst forum going. They are down to about 10 guys wishing each other happy birthday. There is very little fresh content.
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toxicavenger
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by toxicavenger » Thu Sep 19, 2013 12:34 pm
CGSshorty wrote:jeckyll wrote:toxicavenger wrote:first thing that "P" site layout sucks balls.
second, that dude tried to make a profit and lost out, so he is crying wolf now
third, that looks like the same Bridge movement sham that came out a while back. same og, over priced, shelf movement and people still buy it
forth, who gives a fuck
Good lord, I agree with everything you said... It feels wrong
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2
P.com is the worst forum going. They are down to about 10 guys wishing each other happy birthday. There is very little fresh content.
I feel the same about TZ
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jeckyll
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by jeckyll » Thu Sep 19, 2013 12:34 pm
Panerai7 wrote:JBZ wrote:Panerai7 wrote:Shouldn't we then celebrate Panerai's success?
Their watches are successfully sold all over the world and people pay ridiculous money for them.
What I don't understand why there's such aversion from some? Could it be because some failed to recognize future potential when they were 2200$?
I think it relates more to the perception some people have of Pam owners (which is basically the same as the perception some have of Rollie owners); that they are vapid toolbags. Unfair, but there it is I'm afraid.
Well I guess you all live in cooler places and see these dbags with Pam's all the time.
I have only seen 1 Pam in the past year and that was Brice during our GTG.
On the other hand I see Rolex wearers all the time, some show the wrong time I guess they think a battery died and are too lazy to change the battery
Good thing you don't 'have a dog in the fight'... Besides the username I guess...
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We all have the same enemy. The enemy is the tyranny of the dull mind. - - Tom Robbins
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toxicavenger
- President Tranny
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by toxicavenger » Thu Sep 19, 2013 12:35 pm
Panerai7 wrote:JBZ wrote:Panerai7 wrote:Shouldn't we then celebrate Panerai's success?
Their watches are successfully sold all over the world and people pay ridiculous money for them.
What I don't understand why there's such aversion from some? Could it be because some failed to recognize future potential when they were 2200$?
I think it relates more to the perception some people have of Pam owners (which is basically the same as the perception some have of Rollie owners); that they are vapid toolbags. Unfair, but there it is I'm afraid.
Well I guess you all live in cooler places and see these dbags with Pam's all the time.
I have only seen 1 Pam in the past year and that was Brice during our GTG.
On the other hand I see Rolex wearers all the time, some show the wrong time I guess they think a battery died and are too lazy to change the battery
When I was contracting in overseas allot of the Private Security wannabe's wore "P's"
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Expat
- Mama always said life is like a box of chocolates.
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by Expat » Thu Sep 19, 2013 12:39 pm
The Associative Law of Drama is clearly real. Drama is never destroyed or created, it simply changes forums.
Last edited by
Expat on Thu Sep 19, 2013 3:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"30ish years of martial arts and I've actually had the honor of training lots of LEO, spec ops and even SEAL team 6 on base, fitness training, not martial arts, but still the coolest thing I've done.
Full on egg head corporate job and I fly quite a bit so I'm really looking forward to adding to my collection of TSA friendly self defense tools. I have amcouple tactical pens, but I want to up the game and get into some custom stuff. Been watch obsessed for a while but this seems more fun.
Thanks for letting me play! "
citizenfox
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JBZ
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by JBZ » Thu Sep 19, 2013 1:56 pm
Panerai7 wrote:JBZ wrote:Panerai7 wrote:Shouldn't we then celebrate Panerai's success?
Their watches are successfully sold all over the world and people pay ridiculous money for them.
What I don't understand why there's such aversion from some? Could it be because some failed to recognize future potential when they were 2200$?
I think it relates more to the perception some people have of Pam owners (which is basically the same as the perception some have of Rollie owners); that they are vapid toolbags. Unfair, but there it is I'm afraid.
Well I guess you all live in cooler places and see these dbags with Pam's all the time.
I have only seen 1 Pam in the past year and that was Brice during our GTG.
On the other hand I see Rolex wearers all the time, some show the wrong time I guess they think a battery died and are too lazy to change the battery
Interesting interpretation of what I wrote.
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