Because it costs them an extra three cents per unit and they are cheap bastards.
New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
- JP Chestnut
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Re: New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
really? IWC does this for their mark 18 ceramic models? Is this confirmed somewhere? Just curious
Re: New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
Yep it's been confirmed with IWC
Re: New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
Clearly visible carcass and caked on ceramic
- JP Chestnut
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Re: New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
Are ceramic PAMs baked on too? They have the same shitty finish.
Re: New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
Christopher Ward is more open about it, because they don't need to hide and keep their face in front of the real Ceramic luxury watches.
https://www.christopherward.com/c1000-typhoon-fgr4
https://www.christopherward.com/c1000-typhoon-fgr4
Re: New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
Not sure, never studied about Ceramic Pams, Subs are soooo expensive and the CG-less models which are not a Panerai I'd want. So not sureJP Chestnut wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:05 pmAre ceramic PAMs baked on too? They have the same shitty finish.
- JP Chestnut
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Re: New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
I can't imagine that richemont would do anything besides the cheapest thing possible for either IWC or panerai.Panerai7 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:12 pmNot sure, never studied about Ceramic Pams, Subs are soooo expensive and the CG-less models which are not a Panerai I'd want. So not sureJP Chestnut wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:05 pmAre ceramic PAMs baked on too? They have the same shitty finish.
- logan2z
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Re: New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
It appears from this photo that the Panerais are ceramic all the way through, but it's hard to see for sure:JP Chestnut wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:15 pmI can't imagine that richemont would do anything besides the cheapest thing possible for either IWC or panerai.Panerai7 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:12 pmNot sure, never studied about Ceramic Pams, Subs are soooo expensive and the CG-less models which are not a Panerai I'd want. So not sureJP Chestnut wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:05 pmAre ceramic PAMs baked on too? They have the same shitty finish.
I haven't seen any details on the case construction of the ceramic Mark XVIII, but I have to assume it's the same construction that IWC has always used - especially given the price point.
- JP Chestnut
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Re: New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
That case doesn't look machined. I wonder if it just didn't break down to the metal core?
Same iwc style not black crown.
Same iwc style not black crown.
- logan2z
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Re: New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
Hard to say. Whatever it is appears to be thicker than the ceramic shroud that IWC seems to use.JP Chestnut wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:44 pmThat case doesn't look machined. I wonder if it just didn't break down to the metal core?
Same iwc style not black crown.
- JP Chestnut
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Re: New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
Definitely thicker.logan2z wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:48 pmHard to say. Whatever it is appears to be thicker than the ceramic shroud that IWC seems to use.JP Chestnut wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:44 pmThat case doesn't look machined. I wonder if it just didn't break down to the metal core?
Same iwc style not black crown.
On edit- I just looked at this ceramic PAM with the wire lugs. The wire is secured with a screw into a metal fixture within the ceramic case. There's no way that fixture isn't supported by some metal substructure.
- logan2z
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Re: New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
There seems to be some assumption being made that companies like IWC (and, perhaps, Panerai) don't use a fully ceramic case due to cost cutting. I"m not a materials expert by any stretch, but perhaps there's some good reason to not use an all-ceramic case but to put a layer of ceramic over a metal substructure instead. Given that the purpose of the ceramic is to make the case immune to scratches, it seems that a layer of ceramic over a metal substructure meets that requirement.JP Chestnut wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:49 pmDefinitely thicker.logan2z wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:48 pmHard to say. Whatever it is appears to be thicker than the ceramic shroud that IWC seems to use.JP Chestnut wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:44 pmThat case doesn't look machined. I wonder if it just didn't break down to the metal core?
Same iwc style not black crown.
On edit- I just looked at this ceramic PAM with the wire lugs. The wire is secured with a screw into a metal fixture within the ceramic case. There's no way that fixture isn't supported by some metal substructure.
Maybe someone who knows more about materials science can chime in and discuss the reasons why (other than cost savings) that a ceramic case might be constructed in this way. FWIW, Omega claims that their cases are solid ceramic so it is being done.
- JP Chestnut
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Re: New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
Both omega and AP are machining cases out of solid ceramic - at great cost. IWC is using 1980s technology on those cases and I don't need anyone to explain why to me.
Re: New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
That maybe the case but don't charge me like it's a full ceramic and we're good. Also full ceramic arguably wouldn't not crack in the same events those did. Who knowslogan2z wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:34 pmThere seems to be some assumption being made that companies like IWC (and, perhaps, Panerai) don't use a fully ceramic case due to cost cutting. I"m not a materials expert by any stretch, but perhaps there's some good reason to not use an all-ceramic case but to put a layer of ceramic over a metal substructure instead. Given that the purpose of the ceramic is to make the case immune to scratches, it seems that a layer of ceramic over a metal substructure meets that requirement.JP Chestnut wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:49 pmDefinitely thicker.logan2z wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:48 pmHard to say. Whatever it is appears to be thicker than the ceramic shroud that IWC seems to use.JP Chestnut wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:44 pmThat case doesn't look machined. I wonder if it just didn't break down to the metal core?
Same iwc style not black crown.
On edit- I just looked at this ceramic PAM with the wire lugs. The wire is secured with a screw into a metal fixture within the ceramic case. There's no way that fixture isn't supported by some metal substructure.
Maybe someone who knows more about materials science can chime in and discuss the reasons why (other than cost savings) that a ceramic case might be constructed in this way. FWIW, Omega claims that their cases are solid ceramic so it is being done.
Yes Omega Blancpain are full ceramic, even case back and crowns
- logan2z
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Re: New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
Who else is doing a full ceramic case for under $6K? Surely not AP or Omega.Panerai7 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:54 pmThat maybe the case but don't charge me like it's a full ceramic and we're good. Also full ceramic arguably wouldn't not crack in the same events those did. Who knowslogan2z wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:34 pmThere seems to be some assumption being made that companies like IWC (and, perhaps, Panerai) don't use a fully ceramic case due to cost cutting. I"m not a materials expert by any stretch, but perhaps there's some good reason to not use an all-ceramic case but to put a layer of ceramic over a metal substructure instead. Given that the purpose of the ceramic is to make the case immune to scratches, it seems that a layer of ceramic over a metal substructure meets that requirement.JP Chestnut wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:49 pmDefinitely thicker.logan2z wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:48 pmHard to say. Whatever it is appears to be thicker than the ceramic shroud that IWC seems to use.JP Chestnut wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:44 pmThat case doesn't look machined. I wonder if it just didn't break down to the metal core?
Same iwc style not black crown.
On edit- I just looked at this ceramic PAM with the wire lugs. The wire is secured with a screw into a metal fixture within the ceramic case. There's no way that fixture isn't supported by some metal substructure.
Maybe someone who knows more about materials science can chime in and discuss the reasons why (other than cost savings) that a ceramic case might be constructed in this way. FWIW, Omega claims that their cases are solid ceramic so it is being done.
And I don't think I'd argue that a full ceramic case would make the watch any more crack resistant:
Re: New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
I bet it was harder knock this watch experienced than those IWC
- logan2z
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Re: New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
Let's hope so. The watch is $12K.Panerai7 wrote:I bet it was harder knock this watch experienced than those IWC
Re: New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
I fell in love with the ceramic top gun big pilot at the 5th avenue boutique... The newer one without the jet seconds hand and construction be damned. But the only way I'd ever consider one would be from my 5th avenue penthouse.
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Re: New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
I was able to try the Mark XVIII Tribute to Mark XI last week at Watches & Wonders, and the date position bugged me. Apparently it was one of two remaining. I was underwhelmed. Also didn’t think the case finishing was anything special, not bad; but made me wonder about Stowa. All of this brings me to Halios. How is it Jason can produce a watch with a nicely finished case and ETA 2824-2 for $700 and IWC charges $4000. Granted, the Seaforth is not a Pilot watch, but it’s a heck of a lot of watch for the money. Go figure.
Re: New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
Because one is named HALIOS while the other one is named IWC, that simple and one more thing because one has shareholdersR@cerx wrote:I was able to try the Mark XVIII Tribute to Mark XI last week at Watches & Wonders, and the date position bugged me. Apparently it was one of two remaining. I was underwhelmed. Also didn’t think the case finishing was anything special, not bad; but made me wonder about Stowa. All of this brings me to Halios. How is it Jason can produce a watch with a nicely finished case and ETA 2824-2 for $700 and IWC charges $4000. Granted, the Seaforth is not a Pilot watch, but it’s a heck of a lot of watch for the money. Go figure.
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Re: New IWC MK XVIII Laureus
Ahh, so simple; how could I have overlooked that. BTW, who are you? Maybe an intro before jumping waist deep in a thread.bnabod wrote: ↑Wed Feb 28, 2018 6:27 pmBecause one is named HALIOS while the other one is named IWC, that simple and one more thing because one has shareholdersR@cerx wrote:I was able to try the Mark XVIII Tribute to Mark XI last week at Watches & Wonders, and the date position bugged me. Apparently it was one of two remaining. I was underwhelmed. Also didn’t think the case finishing was anything special, not bad; but made me wonder about Stowa. All of this brings me to Halios. How is it Jason can produce a watch with a nicely finished case and ETA 2824-2 for $700 and IWC charges $4000. Granted, the Seaforth is not a Pilot watch, but it’s a heck of a lot of watch for the money. Go figure.
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