Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

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Ryeguy
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Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by Ryeguy » Wed Jan 18, 2017 9:20 am

Let's take a look at the watch that is causing such a fuss.

Before I do the comparison, I want to get a couple disclaimers out of the way:

1) I purchased this watch at a discount. I paid $520 for this watch. I received a discount code after exchanging emails with Ginault and offering to do a comparison of their product against the OWC MS-9411 running the Soprod A-10. I made no promises on the results of the comparison and Ginault asked for none. They have made no promises for future discounts in return for my comparison if favorable. It is a one-and-done deal.

I am aware my investment in this watch could naturally lead me to want to give it glowing praise in order to internally justify the investment. My answer to that is:
- I’m no flipper. I think I’ve sold or traded 3 watches in my 10 year collecting history. There is no financial incentive in this for me.
- $520 isn’t going to break me financially. There was a risk the watch would suck, but it was a gamble I could afford to lose.

2) This is, in my opinion, a “homage” watch. I consider DWC may main forum and I completely understand there are members here who despise homages in general and Rolex homages in particular. I’m OK with that. My personal opinion, as stated in Don’s earlier thread, is “if the original IP owner has abandoned the design due to natural design progression (or by going out of business altogether), then I am OK with a homage. I personally have more of an issue with any of the dozens of manufacturers who are making Sub-a-likes with Mercedes hand sets and Cyclops magnifiers over the date window - IMO key design elements of the Rolex Sub. If the Ginault had a Mercedes hand set, it wouldn’t have even registered on my watch radar.

From what I remember reading, Rolex made approximately 1200 sword hand Mil-Subs about 45 years ago. The going rate for an original is about 2 to 3 years college tuition for one of my kids. If I want one, a homage is the only option.

Why did I buy it?

It was a bit of an impulse buy to be honest. I've been looking at adding a mil sub homage to the stable, but every example I see from the major players have dull flat black dials with printed indices and usually done in that awful yellow / tan fake "vintage" lume. The closest example to what I liked was the MKii Fulcrum, but I have some concerns about pricing, wait times, and after sales service. Plus, for the price asked, I would prefer it to have at least included a bracelet.

The Monta looked promising, except the crown didn't fit the design aesthetic (IMO) and the pricing was ridiculous.

When the Ginault Ocean Rover popped onto the scene with the gloss dial, applied indices and the naturally vintage looking lumen (plus with me having some extra dough in the PayPal account) I took the plunge.

I also wanted to support an American watch manufacturer. I didn't really believe the watch met the legal standard of "Made in America", but I believe the watch was assembled here. I have nothing against watches made overseas, but if I can get one that was made here, cool. I'm in.

All communication was done through email with Ginault. John McMurtry from Ginault responded in a timely fashion and the watch was shipped to me via USPS priority with insurance and tracking. The package was shipped from Stateline Nevada.

What you get:
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Well packaged

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Nice box

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Insanely well wrapped watch. There is die cut protective plastic on every surface of the watch, the bezel and crystal. The only watch I have seen similarly well protected is when my friend picked up his new Rolex GMTiic.

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Warranty card (not transferable FYI), timing adjustment chart over a 6 week adjustment period, polishing cloth, decent screw driver, and decent two piece zulu.

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Movement looks good on paper

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Included two piece zulu is actually decent too. Double layer nylon construction, stitched around the perimeter and at all seams. A bit stiff, but this is one of the few included at no additional cost straps that I could actually see myself using. The strap is unbranded.

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The watch wears well on my wrist.

As an aside, I called this watch a "homage" and I guess that is technically the category, but I think of it as more of a "best of" type watch incorporating some historic design elements of classic Subs into a single watch.

Ginault took the classic, MOD specified, sword hands of the 5513 / 5517. The case and bezel, as HWA’s comprehensive review on WUS points out, duplicates the dimensions of the 11660 model Submariner. The crystal is reminiscent of a tropic T19 as found in the 5513, except on the Ocean Rover it is executed in sapphire rather than the more historically accurate acrylic.

The dial incorporates the maxi plots as seen on certain era vintage Submariners, but Ginault uses a high gloss black dial instead of flat black and chose to incorporate richer looking applied indices in the style of the more recent LV Subs rather than the painted plots of the vintage dials.

This could've been a hot mess of clashing design elements from differing generations, but in my opinion, it works well together.

Image

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Dial execution and lume application is well done. Lume works well with a glow that lasts through the night. This shot was done simply by walking into a dark conference room this morning after driving to the office. The watch was not "charged" in any way beyond just whatever sunlight exposure it got on a cloudy, snowy day here in NH.

Comparison Shots:
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The Ocean Rover compares very well to the OWC. The OWC looks and feels massive next to the Ocean Rover.

I'm very picky on bezel action, and Ginault has made some big claims in this area, and I have to say, Ginault has done very well in this regard.

The Ocean Rover has 120 very precise clicks versus the OWC's 60. The Ocean Rover's clicks do not feel "tinny" in any way, but more like spinning a dial on a machine tool or maybe an old safe.

In my experience, some micros accomplish zero backlash by putting a very strong spring in the bezel. This requires a more robust bezel and bezel teeth to allow grip. Ginault has accomplished a zero backlash bezel with the proper amount of torque required for adjustment. I don't know if I can say one is "better" than the other, but the Ginault is very good in this regard.

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The only Steinhart Ocean One series case I have to compare it to is my Black Sea. The Ocean Rover wears more comfortably.

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My only other "aged lume" example to offer in comparison is my Tactico TC-2. The Ocean Rover appears more naturally aged than the TC-2.

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I wish I was a better photographer. The MM300 has such a killer dial, but the Ocean Rover actually compares well in terms of indices being polished and the lume being evenly and well applied.

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Speaking of being a shitty photographer, here's another example.

What I am trying to capture here is the pinion height detail that Ginault goes on about. Notice how the 2824-2 in the TC-2 keeps the hour hand very close to the dial surface?

In the Ocean Rover, Ginault uses a taller pinion which keeps the hour hand higher off the dial surface.
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My pics suck, but the visual effect gives more depth to the dial. A well executed detail that is probably lost on 99% of people.

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Externally, the bracelet clasp is visually similar to the clasp found on the Eterna KonTiki Date (Eterna offers a great bracelet by the way as long as you can find a fit as there are no adjustment holes).

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Internally, the Ginault uses an unbranded copy of a Rolex Glidelock clasp.

This is my biggest point of contention with the watch. The clasp works (works well actually) and I appreciate the functionality, but it is a copy of a Rolex product currently in production. Not cool. I'd welcome Ginault swapping it out with one of those sliding ratchet-type extensions or even a basic flip lock.

Pros:
- Looks great. It combines elements of Rolex classic Subs into one cohesive package.
- Build quality is excellent. I've inspected it as closely as I am able and can find no defects in printing or dust, or polish. I've spent more on watches which have had these issues.
- Time keeping is outstanding. My example is running 15 seconds fast against the time.gov atomic clock over a period of 7 days. It is as good of an example of mechanical time keeping as I own, and well exceeds the performance of my Soprod A-10.

Cons:
- Rolex copy bracelet clasp
- Too much printing on the dial. I guess it is supposed to be a bit of a tongue in cheek poke at Rolex's verbiage, but I don't want to have to explain an insider's joke. Logo and Brand Name up top and Model Name and Depth Rating down below. That is all that is needed.
- Non transferable warranty. This doesn't effect me due to not being a flipper, but I've always appreciated when a manufacturer warrants the product, not the person.
- MSRP for a relatively new brand. I believe this watch would compare very well against something from MKii, for example, but Bill has more than a decade of production history to fall back upon.

...and because DWC, my homage Rolex with my homage Walther
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Ask me anything about the watch you'd like either here on PM. Additional information can be found at the company website here: https://ginault.com/
Last edited by Ryeguy on Wed Jan 18, 2017 12:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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JP Chestnut
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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by JP Chestnut » Wed Jan 18, 2017 9:23 am

That really looks like a fake Rolex with a goofy dial and hands. Why go all vintage with the dial, yet directly copy the modern end links and clasp?

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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by marchone » Wed Jan 18, 2017 9:44 am

I'd like to see better photographs but your review sounds great. Especially with regard to timing, dial and bezel action.
only accurate watches are interesting

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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by JDC222 » Wed Jan 18, 2017 9:48 am

I kinda like that OWC :fro:
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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by Panerai7 » Wed Jan 18, 2017 10:06 am

Great review Chris regardless of the opinions on this watch.
What BlackSea Steinhart is that, any more info? Is that a Russian LE?

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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by Ryeguy » Wed Jan 18, 2017 10:21 am

Panerai7 wrote:Great review Chris regardless of the opinions on this watch.
What BlackSea Steinhart is that, any more info? Is that a Russian LE?
Yes, that is the Russian forum LE. I had to join that forum and use google translate in order to get on the list.

I wish I lived closer to you (especially as I look out my office window at the snow) for you to check out. It is actually a very nicely executed Steinhart with a look that is a both a bit Sub and Blancpain at the same time. It runs a 2893-2.

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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by Panerai7 » Wed Jan 18, 2017 10:24 am

Ryeguy wrote:
Panerai7 wrote:Great review Chris regardless of the opinions on this watch.
What BlackSea Steinhart is that, any more info? Is that a Russian LE?
Yes, that is the Russian forum LE. I had to join that forum and use google translate in order to get on the list.

I wish I lived closer to you (especially as I look out my office window at the snow) for you to check out. It is actually a very nicely executed Steinhart with a look that is a both a bit Sub and Blancpain at the same time. It runs a 2893-2.
Yep, looks awesome, I would totally get one :love:

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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by matt.wu » Wed Jan 18, 2017 10:30 am

Panerai7 wrote:Great review Chris regardless of the opinions on this watch.
:1:

Looks like a well-made watch for the money. My personal preferences wouldn't lead me to buy it, but thanks for sharing honest thoughts.
:htfu:

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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by BBK357 » Wed Jan 18, 2017 10:47 am

Chris
Your pics are so damn blurry I can't even read the dial text you talked about. Do you own an iPhone 6 or 7?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
DEATH FROM ABOVE
:ak:

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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by Ryeguy » Wed Jan 18, 2017 10:51 am

marchone wrote:I'd like to see better photographs but your review sounds great. Especially with regard to timing, dial and bezel action.
I'm sorry my photos suck so badly. It is actually embarrassing. I'm only using an iPhone 7 and no filtering or Photoshop tools. I need to get Erik over here with his $$$$ camera set up.

Let me know what angle you'd like and I'll post some additional (admittedly crappy) photos. Option B is to look at some reviews posted on WUS, but most of the threads have turned into royal messes.

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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by Ryeguy » Wed Jan 18, 2017 12:03 pm

BBK357 wrote:Chris
Your pics are so damn blurry I can't even read the dial text you talked about. Do you own an iPhone 6 or 7?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
iPhone 7. It isn't the arrow though, it is this Indian.

Image

The dial has a logo (flower) up top, then the brand name.
Below the brand name is "Kinetic Continuous" which I believe is a poke at "Oyster Perpetual"

Below the pinion is the 4 lines of text meant to mimic a Rolex Sub dial. I can't single Ginault out on this 4 lines of text below the pinion fault though, as Steinhart also seems to have same text issue. Squale has their logo placed there which takes up approximately the same real estate, so it seems a common practice. Even my MM300 uses 4 lines.

I'm more on the minimum text style preference. Model name and depth rating is all that is needed for a dive watch. Heck, depth rating is really just optional too. Probably just a personal opinion thing.

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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by marchone » Wed Jan 18, 2017 12:09 pm

I'm not in the market though it's interesting. With that I'll say the text is stupidly unnecessary. And the MSRP is a no go especially with what you and others have paid. That's a real head scratcher.
only accurate watches are interesting

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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by Ryeguy » Wed Jan 18, 2017 12:16 pm

marchone wrote:I'm not in the market though it's interesting. With that I'll say the text is stupidly unnecessary. And the MSRP is a no go especially with what you and others have paid. That's a real head scratcher.
Does the code not still work? I think they were offering a 55% discount to early adopters and 60% if you would given an honest comparison between it and a diver of your choosing.

If you are interested, shoot them an email.

To edit: I'm of two minds regarding the discount and MSRP. On one hand I think the MSRP is very bold given a relatively new brand and unproven customer service. Giving a discount to early adopters in order to get the ball rolling so to speak is probably a wise decision.

On the other hand, offering a 55% discount forever smacks of TV brand marketing with an artificially high MSRP which in truth no one actually pays.

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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by justsellbrgs » Wed Jan 18, 2017 12:56 pm

well done Christ.... I like the size of the G and the comparison shots you provided.

You are a damn rock star, and I'm glad to know you.
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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by Danny_T » Wed Jan 18, 2017 1:14 pm

Dam bro send me the watch and I'll use my iphone6 and photoshoot that for ya. That bracelet looks really good and the clasp looks so well done it really does look like a 1:1 copy.

I do like the detail the way that handset is placed on the pinion. Looks way better that way as you pointed out. That's something I never imagined to notice or look at before. Now I will.

Great review.
Image

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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by marchone » Wed Jan 18, 2017 1:25 pm

Take Danny up on it Chris.

:thumbsup:
only accurate watches are interesting

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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by foodle » Wed Jan 18, 2017 1:45 pm

Externally, the bracelet clasp is visually similar to the clasp found on the Eterna KonTiki Date
More like: externally the bracelet clasp is visually identical to the clasp found on the Rolex Submariner which they are copying.

This is too far over on the homage/fake spectrum for me.

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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by Ryeguy » Wed Jan 18, 2017 1:46 pm

marchone wrote:Take Danny up on it Chris.

:thumbsup:
Now y'all are just being mean :crybaby: :grin:

Erik (Four20) is bringing his photo kit over on Friday to shoot some better pics. I am "sofa king we Todd did" when it comes to shooting watch pics, especially ones with high polish and gloss.

Erik has been off the forums for a while. I thought he would not only shoot some better quality pictures, but also post his impressions. He has zero stake in it, so his thoughts will be as unbiased as anything you'll find.

Then again, now that recreational weed is legal in Maine, he may not be completely coherent. :bananastoner:

So you'll get unbiased incoherence... it is the best I can offer :cheers:

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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by tattoo chef » Wed Jan 18, 2017 2:02 pm

Danny_T wrote:Dam bro send me the watch and I'll use my iphone6 and photoshoot that for ya.
I offered him the same lol .


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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by dnslater » Wed Jan 18, 2017 2:02 pm

Great honest review - enjoyed reading. I would bet that Ginault never sells this for over $600 as that has now been established as the going rate for it.

I still wonder if these are made alongside high quality fakes, and the owner used Ginault as a spin off to legitimize his business. All he would need to do was create a new dial.

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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by 7.62mm » Wed Jan 18, 2017 2:13 pm

Is that thing bigger than the 14060?
I'd like to apologise to absolutely nobody

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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by Ryeguy » Wed Jan 18, 2017 2:24 pm

7.62mm wrote:Is that thing bigger than the 14060?
It is dimensionally very close to the 16610 model Sub. If you can find user HWA's comparison on the WUS Affordable Watches forum, he compares it to his Z serial 16610.

The main difference is overall height, but this is due to the Ginault's use of the domed crystal. Mid case looks pretty much dead on 1:1 with a 16610 mid case.

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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by matt.wu » Wed Jan 18, 2017 2:30 pm

I wish Rolex would do domed crystals on other models besides the DSSD.
:htfu:

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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by 7.62mm » Wed Jan 18, 2017 2:35 pm

Ryeguy wrote:
7.62mm wrote:Is that thing bigger than the 14060?
It is dimensionally very close to the 16610 model Sub. If you can find user HWA's comparison on the WUS Affordable Watches forum, he compares it to his Z serial 16610.

The main difference is overall height, but this is due to the Ginault's use of the domed crystal. Mid case looks pretty much dead on 1:1 with a 16610 mid case.
I have no idea what size the 16610 is, is just found my 14060 to be to small
I'd like to apologise to absolutely nobody

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Re: Ginault Ocean Rover Thoughts and Comparisons

Post by JP Chestnut » Wed Jan 18, 2017 2:39 pm

7.62mm wrote:
Ryeguy wrote:
7.62mm wrote:Is that thing bigger than the 14060?
It is dimensionally very close to the 16610 model Sub. If you can find user HWA's comparison on the WUS Affordable Watches forum, he compares it to his Z serial 16610.

The main difference is overall height, but this is due to the Ginault's use of the domed crystal. Mid case looks pretty much dead on 1:1 with a 16610 mid case.
I have no idea what size the 16610 is, is just found my 14060 to be to small
Slightly bigger than your ND.

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